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Author Topic: Did the Dutch Master 'Cheat'?  (Read 1362 times)

liz

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on: March 16, 2014, 09:38:57 AM
Since some of us have been talking about 'Tricks' to aid or enhance our art, I thought I would pass this on to you which I sent to Pat in Daytona:


BTW, Pat, I went to see 'Tim's Vermeer' yesterday about this guy who spent 5 years trying to prove that 17th century Dutch artist Johannesburg Vermeer may have 'cheated' when he created his masterpieces.  It is a fascinating documentary; go Google the film and Tim Jenison, 'a rich inventor of video gadgets and lifelong self-taught tinkerer' and find out what he discovered.  The news story caught my husband's eye so he dropped me off at the first showing of this movie here in town. 
- Liz
« Last Edit: March 16, 2014, 09:40:44 AM by liz »


doina

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Reply #1 on: March 16, 2014, 09:42:34 AM
It is a great movie and it gives you a lot to think of! In my opinion he did not cheat, he used something he discovered while learning a lot about painting! Thanks for bringing this up, Doina
Doina


musika

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Reply #2 on: March 16, 2014, 09:55:06 AM
Johannesburg Vermeer

 :2funny:
Time to dump the spellchecker, Liz.
Ray


liz

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Reply #3 on: March 16, 2014, 12:30:57 PM
Hi Ray, I tried drawing a dog freehand yesterday and decided that I'm not ready to give up tracing as an aid!
~Liz  ::)


May lynn

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Reply #4 on: March 16, 2014, 02:13:53 PM
Dear Liz;

I have been waiting to see the Tim's Vermeer movie, but, it hasn't come to our
small town yet.   I was hoping that it would be on a PBS special.   Hoping Hoping Hoping!!!

I did search the web for additional info, but, to date no luck.

Michael Angelo was also an inventor, I was able to attend an exhibition
a few years ago and it was amazing the depth and breath of his inventions.

So, I have know doubt that Vermeer and many others used whatever was 'New'
and available for the time to improve their paintings.

May lynn   


liz

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Reply #5 on: March 16, 2014, 06:30:53 PM
MAY LYNN-
I'm so sorry May Lynn,  I misspelled the artist' name-  it's Johannes Vermeer.  Google the artist and google 'review on tim's vermeer' .  The painting 'Girl with a Pearl Earring (1665) is a popular model in art classes.  I hope you get to see the movie or at least read some of the reviews- interesting!
~Liz


Germa

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Reply #6 on: March 17, 2014, 01:00:32 AM
I've been in his studio last summer, he didn't cheat, he just seemed to use the camera obscura.
Rembrandt used cards with little holes in it to use the outlines of things, he didn't drew everything again when he started a painting; one of his students had to knock charcoal through the holes.



liz

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Reply #7 on: March 17, 2014, 09:21:09 AM
So interesting, Germa!   :)


dennis

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Reply #8 on: March 17, 2014, 12:08:29 PM
Don't let anyone fool you. Anyway you use to get the outlines for your painting is NOT cheating. O0


The real challenge comes not with the outlines, but with what goes in between those outlines. I have over 26 yrs experience of teaching students just HOW to fill in the spaces :heeha:
You are what you THINK about - Napoleon Hill


Bev S.

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Reply #9 on: March 17, 2014, 01:41:25 PM
Cheat. . . such a harsh word. The dictionary defines cheat as:
To cheat . . . act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, esp. in a game or examination.
To cheat. . . deceive or trick To .swindle, defraud, deceive, trick, scam, dupe, hoodwink, double-cross,
 
Now, I do not think that the word cheat can be applied to anyone who uses a tool to aid them in the production of their craft.
Think of it this way. . . . a draughtsman/architect  uses dividers, straightedges, calculators, computers, and so on to complete the plans for any building or complex. Are they cheating by using these tools? Should they be drawing these buildings and complexes freehand? Hummm. . . . . I think not!!!
 
To those who say to me. . . and I have had it said to me. . ." you are not a "real artist" unless you draw everything free hand". I say and always will say, horse-feathers!!
I live to draw and paint, it a good thing that I don't have to draw and paint to live!


Daisyblue77

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Reply #10 on: March 17, 2014, 03:50:07 PM
 :yippee:  :yippee: I'm with you Bev !!   :yippee:  :yippee:
Deborah     :wave:

†  This little LIGHT of mine .... I'm gonna let it shine  ♫ ♪


liz

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Reply #11 on: March 17, 2014, 04:36:44 PM
I totally agree!!!  I couldn't have said it any better, Bev!!!  Except I haven't heard 'horse feathers' in a coon's age.  That more polite term you used is like 'a lot of malarky' and 'baloney' (mild) to BS (coarser language)!  There is nothing anyone can do today without simple or sophisticated tools.


I like what Dennis said,


"The real challenge comes not with the outlines, but with what goes in between those outlines."  YES!!!



dennis

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Reply #12 on: March 17, 2014, 05:27:55 PM
Good for you Bev. :clap:  Those where my tools of trade in designing petrochemical plants.


Again it boils down to this: Take a random person off the street, give him a set of these tools, and tell him to design an accurate working model of a racing car down to the last nut and bolt - and see what his reaction and results will be!


Take anyone off the street and give them a template (not even a handdrawn one) and some paints ..................
You are what you THINK about - Napoleon Hill


Germa

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Reply #13 on: March 18, 2014, 01:35:08 AM
You're so right Bev! Just look at the most colour books, when they are already coloured.



Bev S.

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Reply #14 on: March 18, 2014, 01:43:24 AM
This just happens to be a sore point with me, for my very own DH has said that I'm cheating when I use one of Dennis' or Nolan's templates.
I would like to take all the different examples of the one of our classes and line them up and show him what each individual artist has done with the template and ask him where the cheating came in.  Arrgghh. . . .
I live to draw and paint, it a good thing that I don't have to draw and paint to live!


 

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