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Author Topic: Valuing art  (Read 8519 times)

nolan

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on: July 13, 2011, 12:12:49 PM
Saw this article about stolen art in Canada (HERE) and it really got me thinking about how much the price of art is based on how well the artist is known as opposed to the quality of the work produced.

It seems like when you are well known you can produce any old painting and it will fetch a fortune as none of the stolen paintings seem to be of high quality artistically  :crazy2:

How much do you think the value of your paintings is based on your name and how much on your artistic ability?


dennis

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Reply #1 on: July 14, 2011, 01:23:57 PM
Everyone of my student's first paintings, including the children's classes, are 300% better than those stolen. By comparison my student's paintings are worth $millions :clap: :clap:
You are what you THINK about - Napoleon Hill


liz

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Reply #2 on: July 14, 2011, 03:13:40 PM
WOW, Dennis! :clap: :clap: :clap:You have a way of saying things that no one else can beat! :clap: :clap: :clap:

My grandchildren's art is in my trunk, on walls, doors; birthday and holiday banners still in the living room, plus origami, now ceramics; even recently finished puzzles 500+ pieces stay put until everyone's enjoyed looking at the completed work before another puzzle is started, etc.  How many grandchildren do you have Dennis ? :hug:  Yes, we're all gifts to one another and what we do with our God-given talents is priceless indeed! :clap: :clap:


bottleman

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Reply #3 on: July 14, 2011, 05:34:50 PM
The Group of Seven are towering figures in Canadian art.  Members traveled across Canada to paint, and were among the first to depict the Arctic.  Members were war artists during WWI.  Members would go on to found the Canadian Group of Painters and the Federation of Canadian Artists.

The notion that any student can pick up a brush and immediately paint superior work is an enormous insult to Canadian art and its heritage.  Every Canadian landscape painter, including myself of course, owes a debt to these great artists.

Let's take a look at "Gull River", a sketch by J.E.H. MacDonald from the above article.  Look at the trees; they are but a handful of brush marks, yet shape and depth are clearly defined.  That was the magic of The Group of Seven; they captured the essence of trees, rivers, mountains, and essentially what Canada is (was?), a great untamed wilderness.  They did so with simple colour, paint texture, and brush marks.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2011, 05:50:16 PM by bottleman »


nolan

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Reply #4 on: July 15, 2011, 11:52:27 AM
I suppose it boils down to what every person views as good art.


Val

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Reply #5 on: July 17, 2011, 05:34:59 AM
Having grown up in Canada and knowing of the 'group of 7', I can say that while in grade & high school art classes, they were mentioned but never really held up as examples for us. I can say that personally I've never found them to be especially interesting, and have seen works by other (unknown) canadian artists over the years that I would consider superior work. All a matter of opinion I suppose.
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


nolan

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Reply #6 on: July 17, 2011, 11:56:42 AM
I know of at least two South African artists that have become very famous and rich, who are not particularly highly skilled artists.

So now it's still back to the original question, how much of the painting price can be attributed to the persons name, ie. good marketing vs skill level?


Val

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Reply #7 on: July 23, 2011, 02:33:46 AM
 ??? OK... I've given it some thought and decided that in today's world, it appears that more emphasis is placed on a name rather than talent. I have seen and heard of many people who are deliriously happy because they bought a ?????? because somebody or some review said this person was the next painting/sculpture deity. While some of the works are 'nice', some absolute rubbish, and of course there is the odd really talented soul. A friend of mine bought a painting on the advice of an 'expert'...I asked if they really liked it...they said no, its in the closet, but its a really good investment! I can't quite seem to grasp the idea of paying for a painting you can't stand to look at in the 'hope' that someone will buy it down the road because of the name.  :confused: Soppy lot!  :P
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


Val

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Reply #8 on: July 23, 2011, 01:14:26 PM

Smart, well educated high class people know very well how to evaluate the true really good original art .
I'm afraid I can't agree with that statement. Neither wealth nor social standing makes one an expert on art, jewels, wines, or anything else for that matter. One's status does not dictate their intelligence, or lack of as the case may be. It is more a case of personal interests and educating oneself along those lines.
Now... I must get back to educating 'my self' on utilizing pencil on paper to the best of my (present) ability.  ;D
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


nolan

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Reply #9 on: July 23, 2011, 02:01:01 PM
It is one thing to buy an artwork because it is an investment, but what is the point of it then sitting in the closet?

You have paid a lot of money for it, you may as well buy an investment art piece that you like so you can at least enjoy it until such time as you decide to cash in on your investment  :-\


Val

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Reply #10 on: July 24, 2011, 02:58:48 AM
My point exactly Nolan, will never understand some people's thinking.

Hi Sara, I would have to take it that where I grew up and you grew up, high class has very different connotations.
I'm afraid you missed the point.
It is more a case of personal interests and educating oneself along those lines.
[/quote]
What is meant, is that regardless of one's level of education it does not denote their level of intelligence. In my younger years I used to spend a lot of time around museums and especially the art gallery in Toronto. I used to see a very ragged old fellow that would be labelled a bum, vagrant, homeless person, you get the idea. We became friends after a time and I would sit with him and watch as he created some of the most beautiful works out of bits of chalk, crayon, pencil, paint, whatever was at hand. I used to bring him notebooks and whatever else I could buy from my allowance. He had no education past the 4th grade, was crudely spoken and definately didn't exude what one would call class. BUT... he knew the works of just about every renaissance and impressionist painter (he wasn't particular about abstract). We would discuss current painters of the day and I think old Thomas must take credit for much of my artistic awakening. "It is more a case of personal interests and educating oneself along those lines." Class not withstanding.
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


liz

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Reply #11 on: July 24, 2011, 09:07:37 AM
From an estate sale, a $10,000 painting by a well known artist was offered at $500 for sale– on Craigslist.  I would have bought it, but being a pragmatic person I am, if I had money I would invest in gold and silver whose value appreciates more and can buy bread when you need to eat.  Point is that we're dealing with a very subjective issue.  To me the value of art depends on who values it for whatever reason and/or how much you admire or love the artist, that to me determines its value. But this may not count for some people since good marketing and capital can skyrocket someone to great fame, regardless of what the art looks like, and persuade/influence some folks to join the band wagon.  I believe true artists are guided by their heart, not by money.  :painting: :painting::painting:


Val

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Reply #12 on: July 24, 2011, 02:01:43 PM
Hi Sara... Sorry, I didn't realize the topic was about 'copying' another's work. Thats a whole new ballgame. I agree you would have to be a bit soppy to pay a lot of money for a copy of someone else's work. No argument there.  O0  I obviously missed your point, as you missed mine, so...I vote we call it a wash. (pun intednded)  ;D

Exactly right in that regard Liz.  :clap: It all comes back to 'a matter of personal taste.'
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


Val

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Reply #13 on: July 25, 2011, 03:14:08 AM
 
So now it's still back to the original question, how much of the painting price can be attributed to the persons name, ie. good marketing vs skill level?
:2funny: That explains a lot... I guess I haven't read that post as yet!
This is the quote I was basing my comments on.  :crazy2:  :2funny:
Cheers, Val

”Creativity is allowing yourselves to make mistakes. Work on knowing which ones to keep!”

- Alvaro Castagnet


liz

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Reply #14 on: July 25, 2011, 05:54:48 PM
Does this make sense–one, the seller of any kind of art will get only as much as a buyer will pay for it.  Two, the value of an art piece is relative and may be unrelated to its salability.

I've been in many art galleries and every kind of art is still hanging there because of outrageously high prices, big name artist or not.

I think if someone depended on art sales for survival he would have to 1) paint more pictures of the kind people will buy, 2) price the paintings to sell in order to have money in your pocket. 

As for me, I can't afford to buy anyone's art so that's one good reason to paint my own.

I found someone's painting style that I really liked, but when I called him he said he had no time to take students.  He was into big bucks art work at that time, but now with a poor economy his paintings still hang in galleries with 5 figure prices only to be admired. This is the guy I told you with a $10,000 painting being auctioned at an estate sale for $500.

To end my musings I will say that I think a true artist would want to help others to bring out their innate creative abilities like Dennis and Nolan are doing so.  :painting: :smiley6600:


 

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