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Author Topic: A few Questions  (Read 2524 times)

patindaytona

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on: June 24, 2012, 04:39:13 AM
I FELT very much the past 4 days as though I am stopping painting and drawing for good. Totally convinced.
Yesterday, I got out a few old paintings to make sure they weren't sticking to each other as I stored them...then started painting over the eyes of a few portraits among other things. I got involved for about 40 mins.   Could not sleep all night my mind was so wound up as usual again.  What follows is deep depression and extreme aggitation. I know it makes no sense.

It hasn't happend YET this time, but if i continue it will for sure.   So, i need to be careful about my time spent doing this.
Anway, i'll try to aim for one every month or so..no deadlines though. I'm just painting for myself anyway.
I have a question:  Do most of you use just regular typing paper to print your reference photos on? I had been using expensive paper a long time, then started with regular cheap paper. I know I have to pump up the color using the oils if I go by that, but what about pencil? Isn't it good enough to go by as far as tones?
Another kind of strange question: I have to turn my head to view my computer screen if going by that. Is that ok to do that? It won't mess up my judgment of color/value if i have to keep turning around to get a glimpse of these on my screen photo will it? (kind of like depending on a very fast memory that way, rather than having the reference side by side with your canvas)
The moment you find yourself mostly satisfied with a painting and think you'll "just quickly" do this or that, that's the moment to stop completely. Take the painting off your easel and put it aside for at least 24 hours, then reassess whether it really needs that tweak.


Kelley

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Reply #1 on: June 24, 2012, 10:18:12 PM
Pat, you should see how terrible my printer is.  It wouldn't even make a good boat anchor.  My choice would be to have a monitor next to my painting area using a monitor support that can bring it close or a laptop, but I have neither at the moment.  In my opinion, turning around probably isn't too bad unless you are working on specific details.

Hang in there Pat.
Kelley


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #2 on: June 25, 2012, 12:17:12 AM
I've found that looking at the monitor is good but, only if you keep the same distance and angle and, force yourself to look often.
Yeah, I agree with Kelley, try hang in there Pat.  O0
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Lillian

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Reply #3 on: June 25, 2012, 03:50:09 AM
Pat, just do as much as you're comfortable with doing and break away when you feel the anxiety rising.

I'm so sorry you have that problem!  I'm glad you have your kayak and you can go fishing.  It must help you relax.

When I painted my peony paintings, I did the first one looking at my computer monitor, the second one from a computer print out on regular printer paper.  I much preferred using my monitor for reference as the photo on the computer shows more color and depth.  I didn't seem to have much problem looking away, but I did look back and forth from the monitor to my work often.
"The way to be happy," said Winston Churchill, "is to find something that requires the kind of perfection that's impossible to achieve and spend the rest of your life trying to achieve it."


Honeysuckle73

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Reply #4 on: June 25, 2012, 08:05:54 AM
 Keep  :painting:.  You know Pat, in the end you have to do what is most comfortable for you.  And sometimes that takes a while to figure out. I also think you are too hard on yourself. There is no right or wrong way to do your thing, JUST DO YOUR !!! THING.  Wishing you all the best and maybe a mood leveler pill just before getting so hard on yourself and the right way to do things.  :gl2:
Live Life to the Max


patindaytona

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Reply #5 on: June 25, 2012, 11:34:50 AM
I will be honest with you all here. I['m sorry I haven't been commenting with the rest of you on YOUR works. Half is I'm just lazy and other is that I'm not involved as much lately.
I appreciate your comments and input here. I was starting a painting a week or so ago of a guy standing in ankle deep water..he is carrying a small looped whip in his hand. He's standing next to his camel. Well, this whip is so small and insignificant that you hardly notices it and it's really unimportant. Last night I couldn't sleep all night because of that! I am imagining (photo memory) how I'll paint it (using edge of credit card, pizza cutter, knife, etc) and imagining scenarios...wiping off many times to get it right. I haven't even gotten to that yet!
I wake up so aggitated and depressed. I'm basically worrying to death! Not much to do about this, except stop painting altogehter. If I do go thru the process of wiping, redoing, I get my mind into a frenzied state of aggistation and the backlash is...several days of agonizing depression.
I know thsi is all a different topic.

I agree, even though i have to turn my head, a monitor contains much truer colors closesr to outdoors than a paper photo.      Don't you all loose sleep too, if a painting is going bad OR well with you? It doesn't get your creative juices flowing and adrenaline all night?
P.S. I had two teeth pulled today (i'm throwing everything in here, aren' i ;D  But was put to sleep with an IV. injection because I'm a sissy ;D
The moment you find yourself mostly satisfied with a painting and think you'll "just quickly" do this or that, that's the moment to stop completely. Take the painting off your easel and put it aside for at least 24 hours, then reassess whether it really needs that tweak.


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #6 on: June 25, 2012, 01:20:53 PM
Pat! we feel for you here on Paint Basket. It's frustrating that we seem unable to help curb these tormenting issues you suffer. I think you could do with someone disciplining you to a time schedule and giving you diversional therapy like cooking a meal or, going out for a walk etc. I wish I could give you a way of taming this torment. A way that would contain it in a box.
Teeth! Oh dear, I fully sympathise with you on that front. I've fallen out with many Dentists in the past. Hey, perhaps you could get a dose of that IV Valium after you've had a painting session?!!!!
Keep 'ya spirits up Pat. ;)
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


nolan

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Reply #7 on: June 25, 2012, 01:27:00 PM
just keep taking it easy Pat, small bits at a time O0

I print on regular typing paper.

When working from the screen I do try and keep the screen as close in view as possible, but it isn't essential. Remember you are painting your interpretation of the photo so getting things perfect isn't a requirement.


patindaytona

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Reply #8 on: June 25, 2012, 01:50:49 PM
Tony, I'm on the same wavelenght as you...i took my "quote unquote" pain medication just before getting out my painting. I painted some of my pre-mixed colors for about  half hour and put it alway. Believe it or not, this painting may turn out to be in my opinion, one or THEE best painting! I'm not done yet though.
My colors are accurate for one thing. I am also doing it all very impressionistic. And leaving it! I am thinking in terms of masses. A distanct builiding or brick wall..nothing more than the correct color (with sky color added for distance), and a few dashes of the PREMIXED (not any thing that's close by)...of some darks or lights as details. And I mean...simple dashes! I did the whole camel today and his reflection. Half hour work. The correct colors! Simple GENERALIZED LOCATION OF THEM...i find as long as you do not loose the original accuracy of your sketch, then your fine. Once that is blown out of proportion, that's the end of it.
A general lighter value of the camel's shoulder etc. We all know that it is just that..the mind fills in the rest as we've all heard so many times.
I am very happy at how realistic is looks based primarily on the accuracy of the colors alone! (and the correct proportions). Basically seems to be the large a mass (tree up close etc), the "crummyer" and less or no detail). Only in the small important areas (small camel face..which is also part of the focal area), I ONE stroked a dark eye, mouth and ears). That was it. Made sure the turning of the head was right (based on the tracing of the original pencil sketch) and that is enough to ensure it all looks very true. I know..no formulas in art, but for me, i have to avoid getting involved or it will really put an end to my art career. Have to start digging out of it and make my work fast and show all that beautiful brush work.

Nolan, hit upon a very strong point....a painting should never be intended to make it look as close as you can to a photo..it's always an interpretation of it and that should be kept in mind during the whole thing. Ignore alot of things you see while painting. Minimalize.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 01:54:42 PM by patindaytona »
The moment you find yourself mostly satisfied with a painting and think you'll "just quickly" do this or that, that's the moment to stop completely. Take the painting off your easel and put it aside for at least 24 hours, then reassess whether it really needs that tweak.


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #9 on: June 25, 2012, 02:45:16 PM
Pat, I think I'm beginning to understand how you tick. ;) You are a perfectionist. Someone who doesn't have the willingness to call it a day when his art work isn't of a certain standard. A standard set by himself! Well, fortunate enough for us the recipient, we are able to delight in the manifestations of your testing journey. Your art work is our  aesthetic treat. Our privilege to enjoy.
Pat, I'm gonna try set you a challenge soon. One that'll constrain your inner perfectionist traits. I'm gonna ask you to create a painting out of your mind. An abstract that goes wild!
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Lillian

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Reply #10 on: June 25, 2012, 03:08:54 PM
 :yippee: I love the  :idea: Tony!

What do you think, Pat?  It could be fun!
"The way to be happy," said Winston Churchill, "is to find something that requires the kind of perfection that's impossible to achieve and spend the rest of your life trying to achieve it."


Kelley

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Reply #11 on: June 25, 2012, 04:30:05 PM
Tony, you should see some of Pat's incredible drawings that were straight from his imagination. 

Pat, the cool thing about doing this is there doesn't have to be any form or even shapes.  Just the hint of certain colours would suggest interesting things.  It could open new doors so to speak like painting with a palette knife.  It has nothing to do with details.

Nolan, I also appreciate the reminder that this is our interpretation.  It's like telling a story in our own words, but using colour freely instead of restraints of characters on a straight line.
Kelley


patindaytona

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Reply #12 on: June 25, 2012, 05:20:06 PM
Tony and Kelly...i like the idea, but i feel I'm kind of onto something right now what I'm doing with this current one.  I AM a perfectionist, but I'm also very VERY impatient. I grab "bad" colors...haphazard values...starting about in the middle of every painting. I try to perfect edges, values etc, but my impatient side it stubbornly doing all that with the wrong colors/values (straight raw umber usually for anything dark).

Due to my impatient nature, I think what I'm doing is aiming for the pre-mixed color/values for each subject within the painting. Actual painting next day or whenever...my approach seems to be best suited to establishing the broadest, largest masses first using my best judgement of it (as if squinting with zero detail).   Then, usually letting it dry,.....going over it with the other pre-mixes for shadows and lights. Finally a touch of lightest/darkest accents (mainly for visual "variety).
But it's not that simple....I am using very scuffy, brushwork without any refining, but maintainng the original accuracy of my penciled sketch for proportion.    I try to build something up by doing a little on the left side, then clean brush and work the right side, then back to the left...eventually bridging the subject within the painting in this way. I don't want to paint anything "linearly" (left to right). This gives a better assesment of what you're doing.
LIke I said....it's not refined...the brushwork is very "BRUSHY".   But that is fine with me. Because of that..well, van gohg....see what I mean...it's untouched as though the artist is telling the viewer "oh, that is nothing "over there"...i simply meant it that way to because it's not that important in the painting and is shows that it was DELIBERATELY not meant to be imporatant...but somehow, that virgin brushwork has the appeal that is is still beautiful.   (a dab to suggest a ridiculously unrefine brick or two...it's all pure and suggests their are lots of bricks elsewhere...and we don't want the artist to look like HE is so involved that their's little left for the viewers to use their OWN imagination. THat is what I have been doing all along so much.
Anyway.....the simple correct colors (has alot of impact in the realism deparment),  (same with preserving the original sketch proportion),    and the contrast of of these with the brushy, unrefined impressionistic style of the strokes putting down in general large masses with very little or no detail has a great visual variety.   It shows the artist is unconcerned, while being very concerned in other "levels".     And he's no fool. The viewer see that.  Besides this...it is just my nature..I'm too impatient to paint very long on any painting. I would think some artists like V.GOh and others fell into their style beacuase of their nature also.
I do like your ideas on abstracts..i was really really into that with my photography. I think I'm too scared to attempt it though with painting..at least for now..because i'll go "OFF' somewhere and have no reference to save my sanity.
The moment you find yourself mostly satisfied with a painting and think you'll "just quickly" do this or that, that's the moment to stop completely. Take the painting off your easel and put it aside for at least 24 hours, then reassess whether it really needs that tweak.


Karen

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Reply #13 on: June 25, 2012, 10:57:07 PM
Pat, you asked about printouts. I do not have a colour printer so i always work from black and white printouts. i use the computer screen to get an idea of colour, then if it's landscape i look out of the window. I can't seem to get the same colour. mixes as Nolan with my acrylics or colours exactly like the screen colours though i have tried using the colour picker. I've decided it might be my eyes!  I don't think it matters so long as i use a fairly limited palette.
One thing might help you. I have found it really helps to paint along because like you I get very hung up about details and i'm trying to break myself of this. Painting along you just have to do it. It doesn't matter what we produce - though it's nice if it goes well.
I also practice on a bit of canvas away from my painting if I want to get something detailed like your whip right.
I guess everyone gets frustrated. Sometimes I just put the painting away and do another one instead.
Probably, this is all very well, but it won't stop you being anxious and getting the idea squirrels running round your head.
I hope the current painting goes well.   

 


patindaytona

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Reply #14 on: June 26, 2012, 04:23:01 AM
....i know it's real easy to use a ton of words here to make a point..
To be short..the artist's i've been looking at lately and like their style ..i found to be the plein air type (painting on the spot outdoors).  I suppose it's ok if I still paint that way indoors. They probably finish theirs in a few hours or more though. But then I think of Matisse...his looks fast and furious too and might have been indoors. I'm trying to say I hope by adapting a style similar to that isn't going to diminish the value of my paintings just because i happen to spend alot of time indoors on it that way.

Idea squirrels...that's it! O0
One of them...last night told me that if I can just work for 30 secs on this area, then switch to this area for 30 seconds..move on to that areas for 30 seconds or so...it will keep me moving and not start to ponder and dwell and worry on any single area and get caught up in the fiddling. This would keep me from looking back so much on things. It's proably better to do any painting this way anyway..working it from all angles "upwards" rather than in a linear fashion. You can assess it much much better in this way I'd think..as you go along and build it. In fact on this current one I've been doing it with pretty good sucess so far.
The moment you find yourself mostly satisfied with a painting and think you'll "just quickly" do this or that, that's the moment to stop completely. Take the painting off your easel and put it aside for at least 24 hours, then reassess whether it really needs that tweak.


 

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