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Author Topic: Colour Bias/Undertone & The '6' Primaries  (Read 11666 times)

Tony (ASM)

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on: November 24, 2011, 10:47:16 AM
I messed up my Rose painting earlier this month and I sought to determine the reason why. After investigations I think I've derived some answer. 'Colour bias' or, 'Undertone of colours'. What I mean by this is, I'd read somewhere about the Primary Colours and how there was 6 not 3. The basic 3 had 2 variations of each colour. For example, the Yellow had one that had an 'Undertone' that leant towards Blue and, a yellow that had a bias undertone that leant towards red. Confused? Yeah, I was too and, still am because, the Artisan Water Mixable tube colours are offered with one 'in between'! So, that makes 9 Primaries (3 variations/biases of each colour!).
Here is a link to the W&N (Windsor & Newton) website explaining in detail what I'm talking about:
http://www.winsornewton.com/resource-centre/hints-tips-and-techniques/colour-mixing/practical-applications-of-colour-theory/
In my Rose attempt I think I used an incorrect colour bias/undertone yellow that didn't mix well. The result wasn't  what I expected. My Rose colour ended up a bit mustard tone!
Anyway, I wanted to open up this subject for chat and clarification because, I'm hoping to arrange my Water Mixable Oil Primary colours based on the bias undertones.
Please contribute your thoughts.  :)
« Last Edit: November 24, 2011, 10:51:02 AM by Topdoginuk »
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Leana

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Reply #1 on: November 24, 2011, 10:55:07 AM
Tony... this is sooo weird ??? ... I also surfed the W&N website today and looked at this exact page... must have been telepathy  :D
Leana

"Good art is a form of Prayer.  It's a way to say what is not sayable." ~ Frederich Busch

"Art is not just ornamental, an enhancement of life, but a path in itself, a way out of the predictable and conventional, a map to selfdiscovery." ~ Gabrielle Roth


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #2 on: November 24, 2011, 10:56:42 AM
Tony... this is sooo weird ??? ... I also surfed the W&N website today and looked at this exact page... must have been telepathy  :D
Wow! That is well freaky! Yeah, it's Artistic Telepathy where two great minds connect and think alike!
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Leana

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Reply #3 on: November 24, 2011, 10:59:13 AM
 :twothumbs:  Very true  ;)
Leana

"Good art is a form of Prayer.  It's a way to say what is not sayable." ~ Frederich Busch

"Art is not just ornamental, an enhancement of life, but a path in itself, a way out of the predictable and conventional, a map to selfdiscovery." ~ Gabrielle Roth


nolan

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Reply #4 on: November 24, 2011, 11:31:03 AM
I always suggest that folks first stick to the standard 3 colour colour wheel until they are accustomed to the colour mixing rules. Then they can use the 6 colour colour wheel if they want. Anything more complex than that isn't necessary O0

Tony if your mixes ended up mustard then your yellow wasn't a primary, but actually a secondary (orange). It is important to use Cadmium yellow as your primary and not one of the variations like Cad yellow deep (which has red added) or Cad yellow light (which has white added)


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #5 on: November 24, 2011, 11:41:44 AM
I always suggest that folks first stick to the standard 3 colour colour wheel until they are accustomed to the colour mixing rules. Then they can use the 6 colour colour wheel if they want. Anything more complex than that isn't necessary O0

Tony if your mixes ended up mustard then your yellow wasn't a primary, but actually a secondary (orange). It is important to use Cadmium yellow as your primary and not one of the variations like Cad yellow deep (which has red added) or Cad yellow light (which has white added)

Thanks Nolan! That's exactly what happened! I used Cad Yellow deep. The website link I've posted has taught me the bias colours and the 'one in between' so, I've got a better reference now!
Cheers ;)
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Anya

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Reply #6 on: November 24, 2011, 12:58:25 PM
Tony, how are you finding the water mixable oils compare to regular oils?


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #7 on: November 27, 2011, 03:05:28 PM
Tony, how are you finding the water mixable oils compare to regular oils?
Hey Anya, sorry I've taken a while to get back.
The Water Mixables seem ok. I haven't used them a lot yet but, they seem no different apart from the colours. You have to check the comparison mass colour and undertone bias of each in order to avoid variations.
 ;)
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Anya

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Reply #8 on: November 27, 2011, 06:52:04 PM
Keep us updated on them, would love to know your opinion between the two.


liz

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Reply #9 on: November 27, 2011, 08:10:22 PM
I used to do oils but switched to water soluble oil paint.  They handle nicely and the best thing is the water clean up, no solvents at all!  :painting:


Kelley

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Reply #10 on: November 27, 2011, 11:21:45 PM
Excellent learning experience Tony.  I'm glad you posted what you have learned (what did not work and what did work).  Have you made any progress on your painting? 

I'm going to try to finish the petals and start the stem perhaps tomorrow. My last day of holiday.  I've been away for a few days so it will be fun getting back to the canvas.

Thank you Nolan for clarifying the difference and a reminder to stick to three primaries.  I stay away from deeps and lights unless I am deliberately making a change.  It does make a difference.
Kelley


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #11 on: November 28, 2011, 02:52:42 AM
Hey Kelley, thanks for your feedback comment.
Sadly I haven't made any further progress with my painting. I just haven't had the time to put aside and commit to it yet. We've been away in our Motorhome and I've been planning lessons for my Youtube channel as well as trying to get some more work. I'm planning a change in career in the new year. The financial situation and degradation in peoples living standards in north England is like a fast return to the Victorian/Dickensian era and, the domino effect is affecting many peoples ability to spend or, even survive. A massive division of 'haves' and 'have-nots' has resulted from predatory capitalism & government corruption, while the media barely cover it.  We might even consider emigrating.
Once I get a chance to do more of my Rose, I'll post here and then get on with the portrait! I'm looking forward to the Cherry project. Small projects are better for me at the moment.
Cheers. ;)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 02:57:24 AM by Topdoginuk »
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Kelley

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Reply #12 on: November 28, 2011, 09:36:17 PM
Sorry about the off-topic, just wasn't sure where else to post.   :-\ I'm sorry to hear about conditions in England.  I didn't realize it was as bad as here.  I understand all too well about corruption, greed and hardship.  I have seen year round trouble, but during the Christmas holiday it is especially evident... opposite of season of giving in some locations. 

I hope and pray that your YouTube channel works well for you.  Even if you don't have time to paint I would appreciate an occasional note from you to see how you are doing.  I will always be here to encourage you to paint, but here as a friend as well.  I know there are lots of folks here that can say the same.

I haven't signed on for the cherry project, but I did for the portrait.  I am not done with the rose, but I am close.

Kelley


Tony (ASM)

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Reply #13 on: November 28, 2011, 10:56:34 PM
Hey Kelley,
                 Sorry I've knocked the subject off course! I just get so angry at the state of our country and ruined divided lives, mass poverty, divisions and hate being caused by the colluding wealthy scum, while propaganda media BBC & Daily Mail spout off selective manipulated information.
Anyway, back on topic, I'm looking forward to the Cherry project and, the Blu Gum Trees. Painting is a great hobby but, I have to be in the mood and have enough time set aside for each mission!
The Rose will get finished at some stage and it's good to hear you are progressing with yours.
I've actually enjoyed and learned a great deal from all the recent posts Nolan & Dennis have been supplying us. Very indepth information and really great reading.
Oh, my Youtube channel is just something I do to help people, record my knowledge and, to get a ego boost when I get personal messages of thanks!  :)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 11:02:19 PM by Topdoginuk »
''Don't spend life going forward in reverse, just glimpse the rear view mirror now and again then, focus on what lays ahead''.
(Tony. ASM 3rd July 2013)


Val

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Reply #14 on: November 29, 2011, 03:30:42 AM
Well, I am happy to hear you both are going to continue to paint!  :yippee: had me a bit worried there. Thought I might have to pay a visit and box some ears!  :2funny: Didn't know which way to go first...east or west?  :flight:
Cheers, Val

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